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September 30, 2005
Johnson gets away again
It looks like Johnson not only gets to keep his win, but gets away with not even being fined for the shock deal at Dover. For those who haven't heard, Jimmie Johnson and Kyle Busch both failed their initial post-race inspection at Dover, their cars were too high. After about a half an hour, the cars settled enough to pass inspection. Huh? Since when are cars given extra time and second chances during post-race inspection? I guess only if you're Jimmie Johnson.
NASCAR took their shocks and shocks of the two Penske cars and two Roush cars to compare and inspect. No fines, no nothing, except they might come out with a new shock rule. No word on what the wording of the new rule will be, but they are expected to come out with it soon.
They basically said they technically didn't cheat, they just used the shock in a way that it's not intended to be used. They also went on to say that the shocks were within the rules, hence no penalty. But it's enough to come out with a new shock rule.
I'm sorry, it's just plain wrong. It's not fair to the other nine teams in the Chase, nor to the other drivers in the race. Johnson and Busch were allowed to get away with it. No offense to Johnson fans, but it sure looks like NASCAR has their favorite for the Championship picked out.
Picture credit - Autostock and NASCAR.com
September 30, 2005 in NASCAR | Permalink
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Hey, Bill. There was a fine ($1,000 ??) handed to Tony Eury Jr for unapproved fuel cell foam. I don't see how that enhanced performance and have no clue what "unapproved" means. Not something to dock points for dude. Next time, make sure you have your facts straight before you post.
Posted by: 8BudGirl | Oct 5, 2005 1:17:06 AM
ALL THE HENDRICKS ARE CHEATS, THEY BURY
THEIR HEAD IN NASCAR OFFICALS LAP
Posted by: HAROLD | Oct 4, 2005 7:15:41 PM
Great job here, Kathy. I've been reading here for quite awhile, listening to all the whining and crying that goes on (hey - there's more here than comes from all the HMS teams combined), but now I finally feel the need to post.
NASCAR has always been partial to HMS, since long ago they did what they could to help Jeffy win. Remember (for those of you who are not just the latest, greatest fad, trendy NASCAR fan) years ago all the "Jeffy yellows" that used to get thrown when he needed some help? Well, it doesn't end there. Now it's anything they can do to help their new wannbe golden boy JJ (YUCK).
It's not about racing anymore, and it's not so much about the rules. It's all about the money $$$ (especially for NASCAR and Brian France - PLEASE go away and f*ck up the NFL like you are doing to NASCAR).
OK, children, I have my flameproof suit on let it rip if it makes you feel better (or whine like Jeffy & Jimmy).
Oh, BTW, I won't even bring up the latest big-one that JJ caused, and blamed someone else. Hey, I'm not a Jr fan either, soooo.....
Posted by: ihate48 | Oct 4, 2005 8:10:45 AM
I still want to know how a shock absorber that wasn't really a shock absorber could be found to be legal. Would it have been legal to not have any shock absorbers at all?
Posted by: American Outlaw | Oct 3, 2005 3:31:44 PM
McMurray's car FAILED post race inspection at 'Dega. Where is all the belly aching over that? Where is your blog about that Kathy????
Didn't he get by with something??
Posted by: truracinfan | Oct 3, 2005 1:43:25 PM
THIS IS GETTING SO FREAKIN' OLD!! What EXACTLY was found to be illegal?? NOTHING!! It was all within the rules but NO Kathy has to come on here with her Hendrick Hatred and get crap stirred up!! NOTHING was found to be illegal PERIOD!! Why should they or ANY OTHER TEAM be punished? Isn't it the crew chief's job to get the car ready and do WHATEVER they can to get an advantage WITHIN THE RULES??? Where's the PROOF that they were illegal??
Kathy GET OVER IT and keep cheering on Rusty to win the championship! I for one would like to see him take it in his last year! To hate Hendrick so much YOU ALL SURE SPEND A LOT OF TIME BELLY ACHING ABOUT THEM!! If you hate them so much IGNORE THEM and quit wasting your time worrying about them! I am sure that if your favorite had won and was found to be illegal after the race (didn't that happen with Jr. after one of his wins at Daytona, no one was belly aching over that - oh but wait - it's not a Hendrick car so we don't care) you wouldn't be calling for their heads!!
Posted by: truracinfan | Oct 3, 2005 12:04:32 PM
NASCAR gave DEI many "second chances" during post race inspections in the past, including allowing the cars to settle. I am surprised that you failed to mention this....wait a second....no I'm not. Then again, most NASCAR reporting is very similar to the mass media in this country, it's biased. While the mass media in this country is clearly liberal biased, a majority of NASCAR reporting is "good ole' boy" biased. A story involving a possible violation by a Hendrick driver is much more likely to get a lot of "sit" time on Thatsracin's home page than a similar story involving an Earnhardt. Did you know that Jr's team had a fuel cell violation on pre-race inspection for this weekend's race? It sure wasn't a "front page" story now was it?
No fines means that there was no violation! Get it?
Posted by: Bill | Oct 3, 2005 11:30:46 AM
it's unbelievable how jimmie and kyle gets away with yet another fault.
kyle busch should be parked after wrecking kahne at loudon since he's on probation from watkins glen and johnson should lose his win.
last year the rule was made that if your car doesn't meet post race inspection and you win you'll lose the win,but of course the guy in the chase gets the rules changed in his favor.
last time i recall NASCAR said they dont wanna be the ones to interfere with the title outcome,but the 48 is interfering with the outcome by cheating and NASCAR said at richmond that no team can interfere.
aint it kinda funny how the 48 who's in the chase won illegally and HIS teammate finished 2nd illegally? which means hendrick isn't racing fair at all.
in 2003 michael waltrip was in the top 10 for 27 races and in those 27 races NASCAR was picking on him he even lost 25 points for an illegal roof strip at the July daytona race and was black flagged at loudon for his tailpipes hanging loose with 5 laps to go,that same year mcmurray had a rubber piece hanging off his car and wasn't blackflagged,the following year jr had an illegal windshield and didn't get anything docked,this year harvick has been busted a lot and lost no points i dont believe,but lost his crew chief,now the 48 and 5 incident.
NASCAR is picking winners that's why my driver will never win a title or be in the chase.
call my statement rediculous,but if that was DEI (especially waltrip) that did that they'd lose points in a heart beat they'd even lose the win
Posted by: jason | Oct 2, 2005 2:35:23 AM
What JJ had to say about it
Jimmie Johnson
#48 Lowe's Chevrolet
A LOT HAS BEEN MADE OF POST-RACE TECH INSPECTION LAST WEEK AT DOVER. WHAT DID YOU THINK OF NASCAR'S REACTION AS A RESULT OF HOW YOUR CAR CAME THROUGH TECH?
Last weekend we went through tech and we passed. If we were illegal, we would have been disqualified. Points would have been taken away for whatever it was. We passed tech and everything was fine. There was a question. NASCAR impounded the shocks and looked at our stuff and said we were perfectly legal and actually nodded their cap at us and said hey, that's good work, but it looks like there is probably going to be a rule change after that. And that happens in our sport every week. If NASCAR sees something the teams are doing and it's not a written rule yet and now they need to make it a written rule. So we're just doing everything we can. This is the final 10 and my guys are working really hard to find an advantage. We found one that was short-lived. The thing that frustrates me is all the complaining and crying that's going on. When you look at guys who go on five-race tears or an organization that has all five cars in the Chase, they're doing something as well. We all are. It's just if there is a written rule on it, you get in trouble. There wasn't. There will be, I guess, before long and we'll just run on with it.
HOW DO YOU FEEL ABOUT THE FACT THAT THERE WILL BE A WRITTEN RULE BECAUSE MAYBE YOU HAVE OUTSMARTED THEM?
Back to the drawing board. That's our engineers' job. It's Chad's job. It's what all of these organizations do. We all have engineers. We all have resources. We all go to the wind tunnel and we look for everything we can find. It's just the cat and mouse game that's played.
DID THIS TAKE SOME OF YOUR ADVANTAGE AWAY HEADING INTO THE LAST EIGHT RACES?
No, I don't think so. We've got a lot of other things we've been working on. We've been trying to understand exactly what the Roush teams have been doing also this morning. So everybody is working the gray areas. And the thing that everybody has to remember is that we did not do anything wrong. There is going to be a rule made of it because we found something that nobody had thought of yet. But we are absolutely fine. We passed tech with no penalties and no fines and no suspension, nothing. We were a-okay.
YOU SEEM TO DO WELL AT THE 1.5-MILE TRACKS. ARE YOU EXCITED ABOUT GOING TO KANSAS CITY NEXT WEEK?
Yeah, we tested at Kansas and at Texas. We've tested in quite a few places. So we're excited. Once again, we've saved all of our test sessions trying to lay things out so we can take advantage of the final 10 and have our best cars.
DO YOU FEEL BAD ABOUT ALL THE ATTENTION THE SHOCK SITUATION HAS PLACED ON YOUR TEAM?
Well, I don't understand all the hype. We cleared tech. There were no monetary fines, no points (deductions), nothing. There were nods from NASCAR saying hey you guys are pretty smart, but there is probably going to be a rule change. So to us, it's been a compliment. I think it's just normal when something goes wrong, the fish story grows and the car went from being questionable in tech and where NASCAR looked at something, to us being ¾" high, which is ridiculous. I think the other competitors need to believe in NASCAR and realize that if our car really was ¾" high, that we would have been out. Something big would have happened. It never changes. There are always rumors and stuff floating around. The bottom line is that we cleared tech and everything was fine. We went home. There were no issues. And then the hype behind it kind of built some steam and here we are trying to just explain what took place a week later. I'm proud of my guys. They worked hard and found something. NASCAR admitted that there wasn't a written rule for what we were doing. It looks like there is a written rule coming and we'll just move on to the next thing.
JAMIE MCMURRAY SAID HE WISHES HIS GUYS WOULD HAVE THOUGHT OF THAT, BUT DALE JARRETT WAS FURIOUS. WHAT DO YOU MAKE OF THE MIXED OPINIONS IN THE GARAGE?
The only thing that's frustrating in our sport is when a team can visually see that somebody else is doing something instead of working on their stuff and have that same advantage. They just walk right through the garage area over to the NASCAR truck and say, hey, the No. 48 looks like this. NASCAR says okay and takes a look. We've never done that. We've never gone in the truck and complained that somebody was doing this or that. Really, we could have been in the (NASCAR) truck complaining that all five Roush cars made the Chase or that Tony (Stewart) being on a tear. But really, we look at it as a challenge. Those guys have found something and it's our job to catch up and find something else. That's what we'll do and we'll keep looking forward.
Posted by: sue | Oct 1, 2005 8:52:34 PM
Jimmie Johnson said after the Dover race "thank you NASCAR for the championship" LOL thats why I cant stand NASCAR officials they are only for the teams that pay them enough kick back money and you know Mr. Hendrick has plenty of it to go around.
Posted by: rwfan04 | Oct 1, 2005 8:36:25 PM
Another question I have is, what if they had built a car with no shock absorbers (assuming that haveing no shock absorbers would be helpful)? Would that have been a violation of the rules?
Posted by: American Outlaw | Oct 1, 2005 8:01:34 PM
Hendrick's is the best in the business, and every time they come up with something that gives them the edge, you Hendrick haters jump all over them. Just a bunch of whinners. Get over it. NASCAR makes the rules, and if you don't want to play go some where else
Posted by: sue | Oct 1, 2005 7:10:16 PM
It is just amazing how all the Hendrick fans are making excuses for how NASCAR lets Hendrick pass on all the indiscretions, yet they are so quick to jump to agree with the punishment of other crew chiefs.
Posted by: Jon | Oct 1, 2005 2:52:34 PM
Darby even said they found the configuration of the inside of the shock was not consistnt with the rules, but all the parts were. So they are going to make a rule change to cover that configuration to be sure that the teams know that it won't be acceptable now.
Posted by: Jon | Oct 1, 2005 2:47:36 PM
Because Hendrick breaks the rules and they get away with it. All they have to do is explain "we don't know how that happened" and NASCAR gives in and doesn't say anything.
Posted by: Jon | Oct 1, 2005 2:43:39 PM
Nascar once again has its favorites. Looks like Berrier needs to work for Hendrick so that he can get away with things now.
Posted by: Ironman | Oct 1, 2005 1:33:54 PM
Here's an astonishing thought for you, David. The 5 and 48 were NOT ILLEGAL. The 29 had 3 separate violations.
If those violations were accidental then Berrier deserves to be ejected anyway -- for sheer stupidity and incompetance.
Posted by: MBVoelker | Oct 1, 2005 12:55:20 PM
Nothing happens to Johnson or Busch, and what do you know, Harvick's team gets punished. NASCAR equal with their treatment of drivers? Some drivers are obviously more equal than others.
Posted by: David | Oct 1, 2005 11:49:13 AM
This messed up somehow the first time I posted it.
>>It seems the only time NASCAR will punish teams if they blatantly break a rule<<
Jon, that doesn't make any sense.
Why would Nascar ever be expected to punish people who weren't breaking the rules?
Posted by: MBVoelker | Oct 1, 2005 10:33:02 AM
>> and will issue a technical bulletin to clarify the present rule. That's not a rule change, just covering what they missed.<<
Changing the wording of the rule is changing the rule -- no matter how you want to twist it by relabeling it "clarification". Its Nascar's job to write down what they mean the first time.
No sport with a loose-leaf rule book written in pencil can be respected as truly professional.
It they rules don't stand as written throughout the entire season then they were changed. That is both unfair, because the rules change from event to event, and unprofessional, because it not only shows that the rulemakers aren't THINKING when they set the rules but that they don't have the guts to stand by the job they did.
Posted by: MBVoelker | Oct 1, 2005 10:30:29 AM
>>It seems the only time NASCAR will punish teams if they blatantly break a rule<<
Jon, that doesn't make any sense. Why would Nascar be expected to punish someone who didn't break any rules?
Posted by: MBVoelker | Oct 1, 2005 10:24:11 AM
I've got to do an intellectual spin-out and reverse 180 degrees on my original 'they failed = they failed' comment.
Marc has set me straight on a very important point. I thought I read it was 30 MINUTES later that they passed. It was only 30 SECONDS. For me, that gives the fact that the shocks weren't actually illegal significant weight in the whole debate.
I've got to now throw in with the 'ingenuity' crowd. Knaus found a loophole and used it. Smart.
If NASCAR didn't have a firm policy to cover their ass in a situation like this. You got to let the #48 team go free and clear.
Posted by: OneBadWheel | Oct 1, 2005 9:36:09 AM
I just wonder what would have happened if Tony Stewart's car didn't pass 1st inspection...I bet they would have impounded it? Nascar has their favorites..If the shocks were not illegel then WHY change the shock rule? Racing is not as it used to be? Thanks to Nascar
Posted by: Cyndi Reed | Oct 1, 2005 8:52:47 AM
Marc,
How do you figure what Knaus did doesn't fit your definition to a tee. They were definitely trying to deceive NASCAR and all the other teams for profit. It was defiitely intentional, how could you say reconfiguring a shock to push up rather than absorb the impact doesn't follow intentional bypassing a rule.
Posted by: Jon | Oct 1, 2005 6:11:23 AM
Marc,
Even NASCAR called it a rule change and not just a technical bulletin. My only point is if you are going to let one team use the shock configuration to win a race then you should let everyone use the shock configuration. This kind of stuff is what causes NASCAR to think it has to control what specific parts are put on the cars. Look what they had to go to with the restrictor plates because teams were trying to pull fasts ones and get away with cheating.
Posted by: Jon | Oct 1, 2005 6:05:27 AM
"Why were they allowed 30 minutes for the shocks to bleed air and settle?"
The real question is why does it matter? Whether they were given 30 minutes or 30 seconds the end result is the same. The shocks were taken in, along with 4 other non-Hendrick sets, and a problem was found.
And the problem was NASCAR got snookered, didn't expect a team to do what they did, and by not issuing a penalty admit they wrote a rule that was easily bypassed.
And BTW "OneBadWheel" you're one of the few around here that actually have a blog. Congrats. And a WordPress one at that, a man of good taste!
Posted by: Marc | Oct 1, 2005 6:02:42 AM
Enough with the 'creative use of the rulebook', 'pushing the envelope' and 'wacky & ingenius' talk. Yes, it is all of that.
But, American Outlaw, you hit the nail on the head. Why were they allowed 30 minutes for the shocks to bleed air and settle?
If a cop pulls me over for speeding and I tell him "Please, officer, clock me again 10 miles down the road. I promise I won't be speeding then."
What a crock. They failed inspection.
Posted by: OneBadWheel | Oct 1, 2005 2:21:12 AM
And I should have added this for the intellectually challenged and the "my driver was wronged" crowd:
Definitions of cheating;
cheat: a deception for profit to yourself
cheating(a): violating accepted standards or rules; "a dirty fighter"; "used foul means to gain power"; "a nasty unsporting serve"; "fined for unsportsmanlike behavior"
Finding and using a loophole NASCAR failed to cover is far, far, oh so far from cheating!
Posted by: Marc | Oct 1, 2005 2:19:22 AM
Such bloviating and nonsense. No rules were change mid-season. The Hendricks team found a loophole in the shock rule and used it. NASCAR found the problem, with the help of Dale Jr. among others, and will issue a technical bulletin to clarify the present rule. That's not a rule change, just covering what they missed.
Question, if they cheated why would other competitors speak in Johnson's and Busch's favor? As noted above Biffle has and Roush Racing president Geoff Smith said "It was clearly an ingenious engineering exercise."
And it should also be noted the shocks the Hendrick team used were for Dover only because of the bumpiness of the surface. They were "designed almost to work in reverse; every time they hit a bump, the shocks jacked up the car’s rear end."
Not cheating, it's called "creative use of the rulebook" in the best Smokey Yunick tradition.
Posted by: Marc | Oct 1, 2005 2:12:58 AM
Whatever happened to the NASCAR I remember? Crew chiefs coming up with whacky ways to stretch the rules is an interesting part of racing.
You people with this Black and White cheat or no cheat way of looking at it. Cars waiting to settle? That is nothing new.
I recall Rusty winning a race many years ago and they found his engine displacement to be over the limit as the engine cooled it shrunk back down to legal.
This isn't a stick and ball sport. We are talking mechanical pieces of metal. Every case is a little different. It's easy to be critical of NASCAR but it's a hard thing to do. It isn't even logical to say NASCAR favors Hendrick. Wouldn't they want the most popular to be the most successful? But to talk about an E Jr. conspiracy? That will never go over.
Posted by: Scott | Oct 1, 2005 2:05:27 AM
I don't think it was the type of shocks used that bothers people so much as that NASCAR gave them a second chance to pass inspection. I say that you should get one chance coming off the track to pass inspection. If you don't pass then, too bad.
Posted by: American Outlaw | Oct 1, 2005 1:35:54 AM
It's always been about pushing that envelope... all teams have done it.. still do it... and will do it in the future... you know it amazes me as to how many people would rather see all the cars set up the same and just going around in circles.. if you want that crap than watch IROC! And to add to it... those who can't call em cheaters because the parts were legal... are now judging NASCAR'S call on taking more than 1 height measurement... hmmm seems the 12 car didn't pass the weight requirement a couple years back and NASCAR allowed them to add water and get weighed again... and let me say this... all the fans and teams and drivers that are pissed off at NASCAR are only pissed for one reason... that they didn't think about it first... as for NASCAR ... they left that grey spot there... nothing in the rules says how long it should take for a shock to bleed out... lmao WTG HMS
Posted by: BlueDeuce | Oct 1, 2005 1:17:55 AM
MB,
I have to agree if they are going to allow Johnson to win a race using shocks that they even admit violate the spirit of what a shock absorber is then they should allow all the teams the same opportunity to win a race using the same shock configuration. After all that is giving one team an unfair advantage. What NASCAR did with this gives all the teams carte blanc to push the rules because they won't do anyhting to them on change the rules. It seems the only time NASCAR will punish teams if they blatantly break a rule (Todd Barrier) or misbehave on TV (Dale Jr and Robbie Gordon and a few others).
Posted by: Jon | Sep 30, 2005 9:19:42 PM
What's not fair is Nascar's despicable and unprofessional practice of changing the rules mid-season.
The shocks were not illegal, therefore they should be permitted to run them and other teams who can figure out how it was done should be allowed to duplicate them at least until the end of the season.
If Nascar doesn't like it then they should write it into NEXT YEAR'S RULES. Changing the rules in the middle of the game, as Nascar is proposing to do, is intolerable.
Posted by: MBVoelker | Sep 30, 2005 9:01:42 PM
I'm not a Biffle fan, but he defended the 5 and 48 on this subject
http://msn.foxsports.com/nascar/story/4884152
Posted by: DonB | Sep 30, 2005 8:58:24 PM
I do not cheer for Johnson or any Hendrick team.
My initial reaction was Hendrick cheating (again).
But after hearing what they did, I thought it was ingenious. I have to give them props for what they found in testing, and it seems to have worked for one race.
Look for new rule near you.
Posted by: BARman | Sep 30, 2005 8:33:17 PM
Well NASCAR didn't see it as cheating.
What is the sense of having R&D If the team engineers didn't try and come up with new ways to challenge the rules, racing would be boring and all we would see is cars going around the track in a single file, is that racing?
Posted by: DonB | Sep 30, 2005 8:32:17 PM
Tired of the cars being all the same, so it is ok that Busch and Johnson teams used the shocks as spring assist devices and not shock absorbers like the other 41 teams did.
Posted by: Jon | Sep 30, 2005 7:52:50 PM
Sorry to disappoint you Don, but if it was a DEI driver, I'd still be complaining. It doesn't matter to me who it was, I see it as cheating.
Thanks for your thoughts though.
Posted by: Kathy | Sep 30, 2005 7:47:58 PM
Sorry, but it's not wrong, I'm tired of all this all cars be the same, that's what Racing used to be about, a great CC coming up with something to beat the other guys.
If it was within the rules, why should you be upset he got to keep his win, and wasn't fined. Must be because he drives for Hendrick. Come on give them credit. Even Jeff Gordon said he was running the same shocks, and he was 17th when he wrecked, so it wasn't like they were super shocks that gave JJ the win. I'll Bet if it was a DEI driver you would be saying it was ok.
Posted by: DonB | Sep 30, 2005 7:36:06 PM
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