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June 21, 2007
Just Shut Up and Lose The Road Courses!!
By Mark Young
Stock Cars do not belong on road courses, period. I don't care what you say there is no plausible reason why these 3,500 pound machines should be trying to do things that other types of race cars weighing half as much with tires twice as wide do all the time. Yes it is a different type of track that challenges drivers and separates the men from the boys boys darn it if you want to be a great road racer go to F1 or the Champ Car series (or whatever they call themselves this week).
U WANT SOME?
The two road races on the NEXTEL Cup schedule have a flavor of most Busch races. The Busch-whackers are replaced with Road-whackers who come crawling out of the woodwork as teams try to get as many points possible to help them either find the top 35 or stay there. I respect the Ron Fellows', Scott Pruett's, Boris Said's, and P.J. Jones' of the racing world but this is ridiculous.
I wish they would drop these two races and go to Kentucky, Iowa, or Rockingham instead. I sympathize with the fans out there that only get an opportunity to see NASCAR when they come to the road courses, but I can't stand them and will only watch (or DVR it actually) because I need to stay on top of things in case someone out there gives me something to tell them to JSU about.
That's what I think, what say you?
June 21, 2007 | Permalink
Comments
I think that you're really struggling with this week's JSU.
While it might not be your favorite type of track, road racing definitely has it's own place in Nascar for a good reason. Besides being a test to the drivers, it is a nice change of pace for the fans. Also, it does help a little to alleviate non-Nascar fan's criticism of 'round and round' racing. While I can see how some might not like the road courses, running only two in the whole season is really the least that Nascar could do.
I agree with you, though, about 'ringer'drivers. Hiring 'one race ringer' drivers by the teams is an abuse of the rules to get points, IMO.
And yes, Nascar really should add places like Kentucky, Iowa, and Rockingham. But, not at the expense of the road courses. There are PLENTY of tracks on the current circuit the DO NOT DESERVE two dates. By doing a fair and equitable review and reassignment of those dates to new/differing tracks, Nascar could accomodate many more fans. In that respect, I hope that the Kentucky speedway's lawsuit winds up forcing Nascar do divest themselves of their track ownership. That could be one of the best things that ever happens to the sport.
Posted by: racefan | Jun 21, 2007 8:42:44 AM
Nascar's claim to have the best drivers in the world is based on and supported by the fact that it challenges those drivers on a wide variety of track types -- Short tracks, mile tracks, and superspeedways. Flat tracks and high-banked tracks. Unrestricted and plate. Asphalt and concrete. Oval tracks and road courses.
Additionally, road courses are fun to watch. They share many of the best features of the short tracks as drivers try to outbreak each other in the turns and aren't afraid to muscle an opponent to complete the pass. And they have their own, unique element of pit strategy that can make or break a race.
On the road courses the driver really matters. Its skill, not mere equipment, that brings a driver to the front. The big, heavy, lumbering stock cars aren't designed to run the courses designed for smaller, lighter, more nimble open-wheel and sports cars. And there lies the charm -- because only the most skillful racers can make them work anyway to overcome all the challenges and end up in front.
Rather than dropping the road courses Nascar should add two more -- bringing the number of road races even with the number of plate races (with one of each in the Chase). That would require that the Cup Champion prove his mastery of every track type Nascar runs and thus support his claim to be the best of the best.
Posted by: M. B. Voelker | Jun 21, 2007 9:04:20 AM
So you want to chuck aside another piece of NASCAR tradition do you?
No way, NASCAR has been "racin' the roads" for over 50 years there's no reason to stop now.
And BTW if 3500lb cars don't belong on road courses how do you explain the Australian V8 Series?
And you better not let Marcos Ambrose in on your nefarious plan to kill off NASCAR's road courses.
Posted by: Marc | Jun 21, 2007 9:06:14 AM
Road racing rocks! You can't tell me the race at Michigan was more exciting than the race this weekend will be at Infineon. It's something different and it's tradition.
Not sure why Kentucky or Iowa deserve races. They are both small markets.
Posted by: Michael | Jun 21, 2007 9:12:16 AM
No, I really am not struggling with it. I may not have explained myself as well as I would like but I didn't want to give everyone a four chapter novel about it.
I don't like NASCAR on road courses. Period. I do apppreciate your thoughts fan, don't take it wrong.
Posted by: Mark | Jun 21, 2007 9:16:00 AM
Love the road courses and also wish there were at least two more on the schedule. I've been to both the Glen and Sonoma and it's great racing. I agree with the sentiments of others here, it's a great test of a drivers skill to get a stock car to go around a track like that.
Posted by: canucken | Jun 21, 2007 9:53:15 AM
Nothing wrong with admitting I appear to be in the minority on this one. Doesn't mean I have to like it though eh?
Posted by: Mark | Jun 21, 2007 10:41:59 AM
You and Keith are both in the minority if the blogs are any indication.
I can't help but think the moonshiners of old would be cheering the road courses too - afterall, they didn't just go around in circles with their cargo...
Maybe you could mow the lawn while the rest of us enjoy the race....
Posted by: SrRaceFan | Jun 21, 2007 10:51:31 AM
Sorry, Mark, but while your last column about your son was right on, this one is right off. It helps that my early exposure to live NASCAR was here in So Cal, where the Cup guys raced twice a year at Riverside and once at Ontario. The season opener used to be at Riverside a week before Daytona, and for a few years the season ended at Ontario. At Riverside, 30,000 or so would "pack" the meager grandstands. Sure, ringers are brought in, but don't you think that Gordon and Stewart and the rest enjoy being tested against people like Said and Fellows? Beat those guys and you've beaten some of the better road guys in the world. Don't you think every driver would love to finish ahead of Montoya this weekend? And when, since Dan Gurney in the 60s, has a ringer won a road race? Tony Stewart and Jeff Gordon are today's consensus top drivers in NASCAR (NOT necessarily the same as top NASCAR drivers) because only they have won on plate tracks, 2-milers, one-milers, short tracks, and road courses.
M.B. says it right: the chase (did I mention I hate the chase?) should have both a plate race and a road race. In fact, I have seen many people share the opinion: the champ should be crowned from ALL types of racing. 5% of the races are road courses. Who can complain about that?
I'm torn (I know Mike Daley will come back on this one!) about plate racing , and if I can put up with plate racing four times per year, you can put up with road racing twice a year.
Posted by: Doug in CA | Jun 21, 2007 11:00:23 AM
I have no problem with road course racing. I think it is a step away from the ordinary, and provides much better racing than cookie cutter tracks like Michigan, California, Kansas, and Chicago. So, JSU, and lose the cookie cutters.
Posted by: keith12 | Jun 21, 2007 11:03:38 AM
I think road courses show the driver's true talent and ability. It's not just going round and round. It's a different track and seems to challenge the drivers.
I like all types of tracks and think a road course should be in the last 10 races.
Posted by: Kristy | Jun 21, 2007 11:35:17 AM
Add two more and put one in the chase! Make the drivers prove that they have real talent. Ever wonder why Tony Stewart and Jeff Gordon win most of the righty-lefties?
Ever been to Sonoma in the fall? I have. Wow, nice.
BTW, everyone likes to point out that this sport originated with the moonshiners. You think the cops chased them around in a circle?
Posted by: henslayer | Jun 21, 2007 12:00:36 PM
Of all the races in the US, road races are consistently the least competitive. Contrary to kristy and others, road races do not show a driver's true talent because by definition road racing hinders ability to pass - thus is a driver's true talent hindered, not shown.
Posted by: Mike Daly | Jun 21, 2007 12:06:16 PM
Oh, and to Doug in CA.
My home town is Corona, about 15 miles from Riverside. The day they replaced that venerable track with the godawful Fontana farce was a sad day indeed.
Posted by: henslayer | Jun 21, 2007 12:08:16 PM
Mark, I like road courses, but two in the schedule is enough. It's kinda hard to follow everything, but I like seeing right turns for a change.
Personally I would gladly lose two plate races for two more road courses, but that's just my opinion.
Posted by: Kurt Smith | Jun 21, 2007 12:13:05 PM
I agree that as long as we are going to have them one shouild be in the Chase.
I will watch the race Sunday, I am a fan forgoodness sake, I just don't care for it.
Posted by: Mark | Jun 21, 2007 12:18:11 PM
Mark,
I totally agree. The two road course races are the worst races to watch every year. Passing is very rare, the field gets strung out, and the only drama in the race comes when the fuel window to make it to the end of the race opens up. It either works out where everyone makes their final stop before the caution and the guy that's been leading all day wins (i.e. Jeff Gordon at Infineon last year) or the caution falls in the middle of the final round of stops and someone in the middle of the back that already stopped under green gets to inherit the lead and run away from the field to win the race (i.e. Kevin Harvick at Watkins Glen last year).
Fans that don't want to see passing have Formula 1 and CART to keep them amused. NASCAR is meant to be competitive and exciting, that's why it's the most popular form of motorsports in the U.S. Get off the road courses and race somewhere like Kentucky or Iowa.
Posted by: stricklinfan82 | Jun 21, 2007 12:27:20 PM
Contrary to what Mike Daly says, there are lots of highly competitive road races and road racings series in the US and throughout the world. Prior to the American open wheel split, Indi. cars were the most competitive series in the U.S. for decades. And in contrast, road racing takes a considerable more amount of talent to drive and considerable more amount of talent to pass. Not suprisingly, the US is the only place where stock car racing is a thriving, successful series. Cascar is mediocre in Canada. The british series a joke compared to the other racing series. Brazil has a good one. But, all of these international "stock" car series race a lot more on road courses and the cars are much closer to production models, like our GT classes in the US.
Don't get me wrong, I love Nascar, but I'm not so nieve to think that there aren't other shows out there that aren't just as good. I would rank only a few of the current cup drivers among the best of the auto racers in the world today.
Posted by: Michael | Jun 21, 2007 12:57:47 PM
They should just stay going in circles. Passing on those circuits could be done by your mother, whereas it takes execution in champ car and formula 1 to create a pass, not a strategically placed yellow
Posted by: mark | Jun 21, 2007 12:59:29 PM
A NASCAR road-course should have dirt, sand, grass, asphalt, concrete, and gravel. Now that'd fit back in the moonshiner's day! Never happen but that could be an interesting new motorsport. OOPS That's called a rally. :)
Not a huge fan of road-racing but 2 a year is enough it's interesting but not over done.
Posted by: Scott | Jun 21, 2007 1:04:05 PM
Mark,
I got your back bro. Road racing serves no purpose in NASCAR. Even David Poole agrees
http://www.thatsracin.com/108/story/4977.html
They are the ultimate in racing boredom (outside of Pocono or Fontana). TV keeps it mildly interesting because you actually get to see the cars. But, you couldn't drag me to an event where the cars pass by once a minute. Healthy Cup drivers sitting out so ringers can run is just plain stupid, and should be illegal. Ok, and at a track where it's almost impossible to lose a lap, why a "Lucky Dog?"
Like I say, "If I want to see cars go by once a minute, I will take a chair and a cooler and go sit by the highway. If I want it to seem like Sonoma, I will pack a nice Napa Valley wine (They are tasty), a soft cheese and some french bread."
Posted by: Keith | Jun 21, 2007 2:24:54 PM
Geez, Keith, does every post have to include a dig at poor ol' Fontana? "Took my dog for a walk today; made sure I didn't take a route that looked like Fontana or the dog would have fallen asleep."
Two of the best races last year were road races. I think it was Stewart and Kyle Busch in one, Harvick and Robby Gordon in the other one. One was a Busch race, I think.
Mike Daly, you stick to your opinions. That's good. I disagree, and that's OK too.
Posted by: Doug in CA | Jun 21, 2007 3:11:44 PM
How about a double header at Indy? They could run the 400 race and come back and run the F-1 track. It would seat enough people. Thank You
Posted by: BOWLER | Jun 21, 2007 3:22:15 PM
Love the road courses, it seperates the men from the boys. Much more talent required by the driver (versus the crew chief's ability to get the setup perfect) to turn both right and left with an overwieght racecar that has very little in the way of aerodynamic crutches (the way it SHOULD be!)
Posted by: FarmerJim | Jun 21, 2007 3:30:29 PM
FarmerJim,
So, it's a real test of drivers, is it? Then why are ringers allowed? Seems to me the crew chief is making more setup calls than ever...the car has to turn L/R and everyone still has that, crew chief/pit road gas strategy, wins the race mentality. I'd rather watch school buses race on an oval. They're overweight and not very aero...It doesn't make for better racing.
Posted by: Keith | Jun 21, 2007 3:40:26 PM
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